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do you think this is the end of the anc of nelson mandela's party? >> it is not end but it is a moment of reconsideration i think for anc. they have to straz very wisely but they also have to put forward a much stronger set of policies if they want people to support them in the same way. >> brieflily you says nothing in because -- >> because a lot of south africans are going to support the anc. >> with nelson mandela on the top of everyone's mind. >> and the other parties are not offering people all that much alternatives. >> they are stuck with the anc? >> not stuck. but they keep returning the same political -- >> it has been in power a long:00, it is familiar. >> right but it has to do with the fact that the strength of the anc relies on its shapelessness amorphous -- it is a political party that offers people a bit of what they want, a little bit of left wing politics, a little bit of right wing and a little bit of the center and because of that special mix of the african national congress even when people are disgruntled with the party they stil
do you think this is the end of the anc of nelson mandela's party? >> it is not end but it is a moment of reconsideration i think for anc. they have to straz very wisely but they also have to put forward a much stronger set of policies if they want people to support them in the same way. >> brieflily you says nothing in because -- >> because a lot of south africans are going to support the anc. >> with nelson mandela on the top of everyone's mind. >> and the other...
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there was a feeling that the anc was communist? >> i think so. there were many politicians in the united states and globally in western countries who felt that the anc was in fact an off shoot of the south african communist party. that it was affiliated with the larger com communist movement globally. i think they misunderstood history and they misunderstood the desire of black people across africa and southern after africa at the time to seek justice and equality for themselves on the same level. regrettably mr. will was wrong and as were a number of leading american politicians on the right who solved the anc as a communist organization. i would note just historically and it's very important fact that the anc which was established in 1905 predates by a decade and a half the establishment of the russian communist party. the struggle for equality based on the content of a person's character and not the color of his skin was the main driver for nelson mandela as it was for civil rights leader here in the united states. there is a join and conjunct
there was a feeling that the anc was communist? >> i think so. there were many politicians in the united states and globally in western countries who felt that the anc was in fact an off shoot of the south african communist party. that it was affiliated with the larger com communist movement globally. i think they misunderstood history and they misunderstood the desire of black people across africa and southern after africa at the time to seek justice and equality for themselves on the...
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in other words the 80% of the population that is black has voted overwhelmingly for the anc. the opposition party has been predominately white. so unless or until south africa breaks out of that particular mold, it is difficult to bring about rapid change. so is it too much to ask, the people in townships, is it too much to ask of the government, 20 years of afc rule, to have brought about the dramatic changes that have improved the lives of the people in the townships? >> two issues here. twenty-first is the overall rate of economic growth has been disappointing. it's a little over 3% a year, that's substantially less. than say in china. the second is the educational system has failed the population. for reasons can are obscure. not very similar. about a quarter of the country's budget is on education. that being the case, why isn't the delivery very much better. >> that's a question we ask here in the united states. >> we do. >> so -- no one wants to be thought of as being pessimistic, or apisms so what degree of optimism do you have for the future of south africa. >> oh, p
in other words the 80% of the population that is black has voted overwhelmingly for the anc. the opposition party has been predominately white. so unless or until south africa breaks out of that particular mold, it is difficult to bring about rapid change. so is it too much to ask, the people in townships, is it too much to ask of the government, 20 years of afc rule, to have brought about the dramatic changes that have improved the lives of the people in the townships? >> two issues...
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the policy of forgiveness reconsideration was always anc policy. so that it didn't take prison to do that. theory jet stream tried to plague down how badly it was treating the prisoners. this photograph was a staged event. >> you didn't know this was taken. >> no, we didn't know this was taken. >> the government was trying to make him think he was only doing light work, the prisoners had wondered why for one day only the laboring became easy, but it was to get tougher later, the laboring moved to what was an open lime quarry, 13 years of hard toll breaking rock, the dazzling reflection of white stone, damaging their eyesight. when they weren't laboring, they were sometimes allowed visits in this gloomy building, his second wife an activist herself came under a travel babb, one stage mandela waited two years between her visits. >> by regulation, there was a minimum of six months between each visit, and also by regulation, there was no contact. a screen between husband and wife, winny would sit on this side, the communication through a speaker. a max
the policy of forgiveness reconsideration was always anc policy. so that it didn't take prison to do that. theory jet stream tried to plague down how badly it was treating the prisoners. this photograph was a staged event. >> you didn't know this was taken. >> no, we didn't know this was taken. >> the government was trying to make him think he was only doing light work, the prisoners had wondered why for one day only the laboring became easy, but it was to get tougher later,...
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war and didn't have that significant blood shed and didn't have the call for revenge and in the new anc there are members and some younger who still want that, they want to take property back from whites in country and some are worried with mandela being gone less of a moderation of views. >> that is why he is a controversial figure and represents the future of anc and you see streets on the stadium and their names are being changed and some people who had english names on the streets that live for years and years are seeing the change happen and for some it's unsettling. >> this is a celebration and seeing more sadness now than you had earlier but it's here and hearing cheering in the background and we will be out here and we will keep on talking to people and we will send you back there in a few minutes. >> thank you, appreciate it, thank you very much. let's talk about what ali raised and morgan raised which is talking about south africa moving forward and also looking back as well. and you wanted to take issue with this idea of a civil war, right, in your mind, proud south african,
war and didn't have that significant blood shed and didn't have the call for revenge and in the new anc there are members and some younger who still want that, they want to take property back from whites in country and some are worried with mandela being gone less of a moderation of views. >> that is why he is a controversial figure and represents the future of anc and you see streets on the stadium and their names are being changed and some people who had english names on the streets...
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. >> corruption and scandals rampant in the anc political party, and white-owned businesses are in lieu contra-tive partnerships with the investors. the gap between rich and poor is still one of the largest in the world. south africa's struggle would not have been denied by mandela. president obama touched on the human side of the global icon. >> smiling and serene, detached from the tawdry affairs. he resisted such a life. [ cheering ] >> instead, madiba insisted on sharing with us his doubts and spirits. i'm not a saint, he said, unless you think of a saint as a sinner who keeps on trying. ♪ >> joining us to discuss nelson mandela's commitment to reconciliation and the transfer imagination of south africa into a multi racial republic in cape down glenda, director of transformation services at the university of cape town. she was a commissioner on the south africaen commission. and dave stewart, chief of staff to former president declerk. here in our studio, senior scholar at the wilson center in washington, d.c. and author of "chained together: mandela, de clerc." my guests are very
. >> corruption and scandals rampant in the anc political party, and white-owned businesses are in lieu contra-tive partnerships with the investors. the gap between rich and poor is still one of the largest in the world. south africa's struggle would not have been denied by mandela. president obama touched on the human side of the global icon. >> smiling and serene, detached from the tawdry affairs. he resisted such a life. [ cheering ] >> instead, madiba insisted on sharing...
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. >> the truth is the anc is la really struggled to fulfill nelson mandela's idealistic vision, school buildings are falling apart and crowding is rife. schools ton bleak cape flat south side cape town is more symbolistic of the system struggling with. activists argued there is a dangerous gap between promise of education and what it actually delivers. schools boast a 70% pass rate. but to graduate students only need 30% on their exams. a third of them won't be literate by the time they leave. >> and the end of the study about 50% of those young people have fallen out of the system. so it also has to do with the curriculum, it has -- also has to do with the kind of training that our teachers had during end today. >> so schools are still struggling with the legacy of apartheid, its burden stubbornly persistent, the burdens of the system much longer than nelson mandela ever imagined. peter gresta, al jazeera, cape town. >> again as mills around the world gathered to remember the man they knew as the father of south africa, honored more for what he didn't do than what he could have done,
. >> the truth is the anc is la really struggled to fulfill nelson mandela's idealistic vision, school buildings are falling apart and crowding is rife. schools ton bleak cape flat south side cape town is more symbolistic of the system struggling with. activists argued there is a dangerous gap between promise of education and what it actually delivers. schools boast a 70% pass rate. but to graduate students only need 30% on their exams. a third of them won't be literate by the time they...
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didn't feel that the government and the governments of western europe the at the time supported the anc and the antiapartheid cause joie. >> world leaders coming to pay their respects to nelson mandela, they are the poorest people of south africa whose lives were so impacted by what nelson mandela did. cause. this is the country where 85% of the population, the black population had access to virtually nothing while only a small percentage had access to education and property and wealth. you know in the old days under apartheid blacks couldn't live in the city centers where i am now, they would come in on a daily basis. one of those outsecurities was alexandra township, now fully part of it. just beyond alexandra is the suburb of sandton, probably the richest place on the entire continent, more millionaires in sandton than anywhere else. i went, it wasn't good for 70,000 anyway, but at least double that number live there and some say maybe 3 quarter of a million people live there. there are some houses that the post-apartheid government built, they are small? they have electricity, the s
didn't feel that the government and the governments of western europe the at the time supported the anc and the antiapartheid cause joie. >> world leaders coming to pay their respects to nelson mandela, they are the poorest people of south africa whose lives were so impacted by what nelson mandela did. cause. this is the country where 85% of the population, the black population had access to virtually nothing while only a small percentage had access to education and property and wealth....
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the since then the anc has really struggled to fulfill nelson mandela's idealistic mission. overcrowding is rife. schools on the bleak south side capetown are more typical the system is troubled with. >> information technology. >> activists argue, there is a dangerous gap between the promise of education and what it actually delivers. schools boast a 70% pass rate but to graduate students only need 30% of on their exams. a third of them won't be literate by the time they leave. >> about 50% of those young people have fallen out of the system. so irt also has to do with the curriculum. it also has to do with the kind of training that our teachers had during the end today. >> so schools are still struggling with the legacy of apartheid, this generation is bearing the scars of the system much longer than nelson mandela ever imagined. peti gresta, al jazeera, cape town. >> the short list of the world football, surprises el madrid and bril brilliant in 2013, spog 16 goals for club and country. barcelona's are star has won this crown but argentina has been troubled by injury this
the since then the anc has really struggled to fulfill nelson mandela's idealistic mission. overcrowding is rife. schools on the bleak south side capetown are more typical the system is troubled with. >> information technology. >> activists argue, there is a dangerous gap between the promise of education and what it actually delivers. schools boast a 70% pass rate but to graduate students only need 30% of on their exams. a third of them won't be literate by the time they leave....
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anc,eputy president of the african national congress, the ruling party, the crowd was interrupting in an amazing jubilation. they were so happy that so many people had come to south africa to not only revere your the man that they loved so much that the fact that a south african man has become an international icon. absolute joy. and also the fact that south africa was able to pull this off over the last four days. they put together a very important event, with a lot of security issues as well. teams like we overcome that -- have overcome that. note,important thing to this national memorial service comes 20 years to the day since kerk wasla and fw de awarded the nobel peace prize. has de klerk book in yet? >> we know he will not be addressing the crowd. but we know who will be speaking -- president obama, we have , in china, the vice president will be addressing the crowd. i, cuba as well. and we talk about reconciliation. a lot of people from verizon walks of life and heads of state which we know already have some tensions brewing. i wonder if this is going to be a time where not onl
anc,eputy president of the african national congress, the ruling party, the crowd was interrupting in an amazing jubilation. they were so happy that so many people had come to south africa to not only revere your the man that they loved so much that the fact that a south african man has become an international icon. absolute joy. and also the fact that south africa was able to pull this off over the last four days. they put together a very important event, with a lot of security issues as well....
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there were parts of his coalition, the anc, that were pro-communist. correct me if i'm wrong, but mandela always down through the years, when he got his freedom, when he took office and afterwards, was a firm anti-communist. >> well, he was -- i don't know fully whether he was a firm anti-communist in the sense of what you call soviet communism, but he was firm in that he did not want to give the impression that he was going to turn black nationalism into black racial discrimination against whites. >> i think that really is the point, mr. johnson. he was first and foremost an african nationalist. there were communists who wanted to coopt, if you will, the movement there and he once famously went onstage at a rally of i believe the african national congress and tore up the posters of the communists who had tried to sort of commandeer the movement over there. larry, a moment ago used the word forgiveness. there was a divineness about this man's spirit, wasn't there? >> i think you would have to say if anybody would ever dare say that someone carried a ch
there were parts of his coalition, the anc, that were pro-communist. correct me if i'm wrong, but mandela always down through the years, when he got his freedom, when he took office and afterwards, was a firm anti-communist. >> well, he was -- i don't know fully whether he was a firm anti-communist in the sense of what you call soviet communism, but he was firm in that he did not want to give the impression that he was going to turn black nationalism into black racial discrimination...
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and i think he came to that very early on as he transitioned out of being a prison and head of the anc to president of a nation. >> robert, thank you very much for joining us this morning. and sharing your remembrances. we really appreciate it. >> thanks, becky, we'll see you guys. >> all right. see you soon, hopefully. >>> coming up, the november jobs report minutes away. and then our news maker of the morning, philadelphia fed -- along with our other news makers, president charles plosser live at 8:40 eastern. [ male announcer ] the parking lot helps by letting us know who's coming. the carts keep everyone on the right track. the power tools introduce themselves. all the bits and bulbs keep themselves stocked. and the doors even handle the checkout so we can work on that thing that's stuck in the thing. [ female announcer ] today, cisco is connecting the internet of everything. so everyone goes home happy. [ female announcer ] (announcer) at scottrade, our clto make their money do more.re (ann) to help me plan my next move, i take scottrade's free, in-branch seminars... plus, their l
and i think he came to that very early on as he transitioned out of being a prison and head of the anc to president of a nation. >> robert, thank you very much for joining us this morning. and sharing your remembrances. we really appreciate it. >> thanks, becky, we'll see you guys. >> all right. see you soon, hopefully. >>> coming up, the november jobs report minutes away. and then our news maker of the morning, philadelphia fed -- along with our other news makers,...
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there's still an emotional attachment to the anc. but a lot of people here and within the anc are starting to question where this party will take them in the next 20 years. and i think it's going to be a very difficult road, not only for the party but for this country, as it navigates i suppose the post-mandela era. and i think there are, depending who you speak to, there are challenges. there are complexities. and south africans are very much aware of that. >> sort of the young firebrand leader who's broken away from the anc, created his own party. >> he's caused a huge amount of trouble, julius melema. they've kicked him out of the party of that wing. even president obama when he went to south africa just a few months ago talked about the great transformation in all sorts of ways. there are many many ways, south africa for awhile was the engine of africa for a long time after mandela and democracy came. but it's slowing down obviously the growth, and there is massive corruption as robyn said. and the president pointed that out. thi
there's still an emotional attachment to the anc. but a lot of people here and within the anc are starting to question where this party will take them in the next 20 years. and i think it's going to be a very difficult road, not only for the party but for this country, as it navigates i suppose the post-mandela era. and i think there are, depending who you speak to, there are challenges. there are complexities. and south africans are very much aware of that. >> sort of the young firebrand...
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what happens when mandela goes effectively to the anc majority. there's still more than 60% of the vote is what they get. they're being challenged from both left and right. that's going to be very interesting once we've gone through the next few weeks of memorialization as to how the dust settles on that. >> peter, 15 seconds, do you think -- i'm sorry about this -- but do you think mandela's legacy will stay alive or is this one of these moments which seems very, very profound, five years ago we will have forgotten him 1234. >> talking about the brand of mandela is the emphasis on the u.s. has been so much on the forgiveness that we have forgotten that he only forgave once he had actually overcome an unjust system and that the struggle in south africa continues to create a more just society. just as it did in the united states after legal segregation was abolished but there were still massive economic inequities. my hope is mandela is not too domesticated and sanitized now in his death. >> thank you all three of you. the two peters, a wonderful p
what happens when mandela goes effectively to the anc majority. there's still more than 60% of the vote is what they get. they're being challenged from both left and right. that's going to be very interesting once we've gone through the next few weeks of memorialization as to how the dust settles on that. >> peter, 15 seconds, do you think -- i'm sorry about this -- but do you think mandela's legacy will stay alive or is this one of these moments which seems very, very profound, five...
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to what extent can they keep him, what happens when mandela goes effectively to the anc majority. they're still more than 60% of the vote is what they get, but they're being challenged from essentially both left and right. and that's going to be very interesting once we have gone through the next few weeks of memorialization and how the dust settles on that. >> 15 seconds, do you think that mandela's legacy will stay alive or is this one of those moments which seems very, very profound five years ago will have forgotening him? >> my fear, talking about the brand of mandela's legacy is that the west, the emphasis has been so much on his legacy, that once he forgive and had overcome an unjust system, and that the struggle continues to create a more just society, just as it did in the united states after legal segregation was aboll learned. my hope a s that mandela isn't too domesticated and sanitized now in his death. >> thank you all three of you. wonderful panel. up next, japan loves violent video games, just like america. but they have almost no gun violence. why? we'll explain o
to what extent can they keep him, what happens when mandela goes effectively to the anc majority. they're still more than 60% of the vote is what they get, but they're being challenged from essentially both left and right. and that's going to be very interesting once we have gone through the next few weeks of memorialization and how the dust settles on that. >> 15 seconds, do you think that mandela's legacy will stay alive or is this one of those moments which seems very, very profound...
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at one point the anc made decisions to try and take away all the symbols of the springboks. he knew this was wrong, the whites would think they weren't wanted in south africa. and he got the anc to change its mind and he turned the springboks into a team which supported by whites and blacks alike. it became a truly national team. this was his way or a small example, if you like, of how to unify our nations. he had a sense of purpose. and i only wish we had three or four mandela's scattered around the world now and then we'd never feel the problems that bedevil us all. >> yeah, indeed, absolutely. prime minister frazier, thank you so much for sharing your memories and your time you spent with nelson mandela. we appreciate it very much. thank you, sir. >> it's wonderful to hear all these stories, all these recollections of these private meetings. >> what people say about mandela is he knew the value of something which is called a teachable moment. something we have heard about of late. he knew the value of wearing that springboks jersey at the world couple. he knew the power o
at one point the anc made decisions to try and take away all the symbols of the springboks. he knew this was wrong, the whites would think they weren't wanted in south africa. and he got the anc to change its mind and he turned the springboks into a team which supported by whites and blacks alike. it became a truly national team. this was his way or a small example, if you like, of how to unify our nations. he had a sense of purpose. and i only wish we had three or four mandela's scattered...
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lots of times, that it wasn't just me who created this democracy, it was the collective, it was the anc, the african national congress, the people who sacrificed their lives who aren't on the world stage, who didn't, you know, make it to be the heros of the struggle. and he was always a party man and he was always saying it wasn't only his fault. it wasn't only his creation. >> that he was part of a group of again racing of a number of generations of young activists who brought an end to apartheid. so when we talk about his political life, it's important to remember that it was rich and it was nuanced and it wasn't as simple as saying he was the sole leader of this democracy. take a listen. [ music playing ] >> reporter: it was here in johannesburg that nelson mandela's political consciouses in was awakened, the leader of the youth wing of the african national congress the anc, can young mandela made a decision to fight the apartheid state with force. he was prepared for the worst, even when he and others were tried for treason and sabotage, acts punishable by death. >> it would have be
lots of times, that it wasn't just me who created this democracy, it was the collective, it was the anc, the african national congress, the people who sacrificed their lives who aren't on the world stage, who didn't, you know, make it to be the heros of the struggle. and he was always a party man and he was always saying it wasn't only his fault. it wasn't only his creation. >> that he was part of a group of again racing of a number of generations of young activists who brought an end to...
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are we covering up some of the realities of how individuals regarded both the anc and more specifically, nelson mandela in all these eulogies? >> i think no doubt we are. nelson mandela's spiritual giant, political revolutionary, we are witnessing the santa clausification of nelson mandel. a we turned the revolutionary into an old man with a toy bag. no longer really full of the fire. we can at 95, brother nelson mandela was still full of fire. he had that militant tenderness and sub versive sweetness and radical gentleness, tied to refusing to be fearful or intimidated in the face of a vicious white supremacist apartheid regime. >> ted cruz, the senator from texas, paid respect on facebook. he said nelson mandela will live in history for defenders of liberty around the globe. someone said he was a murderer and a communist. another one said sad to see you feel this way. he was a terrorist. i guess you have only seen the hollywood movies. getting away from what the comment section of the internet generally is, let's talk about some of these specific charges. communist, terrorist. where d
are we covering up some of the realities of how individuals regarded both the anc and more specifically, nelson mandela in all these eulogies? >> i think no doubt we are. nelson mandela's spiritual giant, political revolutionary, we are witnessing the santa clausification of nelson mandel. a we turned the revolutionary into an old man with a toy bag. no longer really full of the fire. we can at 95, brother nelson mandela was still full of fire. he had that militant tenderness and sub...
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remember, the anc was a radical revolutionary organization. it drew a lot of support from communist countries, from revolutionary movements, castro, gadhafi, arafat. everyone thought he was going to be a left wing maniac. he was very pro business. he was very pro markets because he understood the future of south africa depended on the white business class staying there, being productive. interestingly, 27 years in prison he came out of an old left wing background. he didn't bust the budget spending money on blacks. because of that corporations trusted him. they understood that he didn't want to nationalize anything. he's asking us to behave ethically. i think it's a very good model for the future for third world leaders, particularly to look at. you can, you know, as long as you understand the power of the market, you can also understand that you can ask businesspeople to behave honorably. >> your prime time special "global lessons on guns" tomorrow night 7:00 p.m. right here on cnn. thank you. >>> coming up, elton john, shania twain, celine d
remember, the anc was a radical revolutionary organization. it drew a lot of support from communist countries, from revolutionary movements, castro, gadhafi, arafat. everyone thought he was going to be a left wing maniac. he was very pro business. he was very pro markets because he understood the future of south africa depended on the white business class staying there, being productive. interestingly, 27 years in prison he came out of an old left wing background. he didn't bust the budget...
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in fact, lots of people called at that time the anc terrorists and when he came out of prison, when he said i say to you all, take your guns, your knives, your pangers and throw them into the sea, fully declaring in his first -- practically his first public address after 28 years of being in the wilderness in prison, no, this has to be peaceful. this was huge and then you know, you heard president zuma say this is the father, the founding father of our democratic south africa, and you heard robyn talk about the tribal homeland where he lived and the rural area where he's going to be finally laid to rest, and i think i will never forget the pictures not just of the snaking lines of hundreds of thousands of millions of people in the towns and the cities who cast their ballots for nelson mandela in 1994, but the helicopter shots of the countryside, when people were literally lining up in zigzag lines so quietly, so peacefully, so joyfully, just to have the privilege of casting their first ever vote in 1994, this majority black country, they had never had that right before and they stepped
in fact, lots of people called at that time the anc terrorists and when he came out of prison, when he said i say to you all, take your guns, your knives, your pangers and throw them into the sea, fully declaring in his first -- practically his first public address after 28 years of being in the wilderness in prison, no, this has to be peaceful. this was huge and then you know, you heard president zuma say this is the father, the founding father of our democratic south africa, and you heard...
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he was there really because he was an incredibly loyal person to anyone who supported him and the anc during his long imprisonment and democrats had supported sanctions on south africa so he wanted to be there, he wanted to be at our convention. he later came to the inauguration. and then hillary and vice president gore led a delegation to his inauguration in '94 and just five months later, he came to the united states on a state visit. that's when we really started becoming friends and i had the honor of working with him throughout the entire span of his presidency and one of the things that sometimes gets lost in the incredible personal impact he made on the world because of the way he handled imprisonment is that he was a very, very good president. i think he was an extremely effective president of south africa. >> i remember when you and hillary clinton and the first lady toured that robben island cell where he had spent so many years back in 1998. what was that like? >> well, it was amazing. he talked to me about it and i'll never forget, one of the most enduring conversations i
he was there really because he was an incredibly loyal person to anyone who supported him and the anc during his long imprisonment and democrats had supported sanctions on south africa so he wanted to be there, he wanted to be at our convention. he later came to the inauguration. and then hillary and vice president gore led a delegation to his inauguration in '94 and just five months later, he came to the united states on a state visit. that's when we really started becoming friends and i had...
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. >> when he was sentenced to life in prison, there were eight or nine prisoners, anc members. the government of south africa had a decision, we could execute them. they decided not to do that. we could send them to robben island and put them in the south african system so they weren't together. they didn't want to do that because they thought it would be like individual germs and affect the whole system. but by keeping them together on robben island, they loved each other and reinforced each other. they were studying and keeping body and soul together. in a way that it was much harder for the other people and much hard are for his wife winnie who had to keep the family together outside. >> he said he sneaked one past the guards by getting the economyist into the cell. no slight to "time" but he couldn't get "time." but the "economist". >> and he wanted to read "war and peace". >> your piece is a great one. i feel like i just got to the surface. have a good weekend. >>> as we mentioned, nelson mandela managed to touch about every part of the world. and in the entertainment real
. >> when he was sentenced to life in prison, there were eight or nine prisoners, anc members. the government of south africa had a decision, we could execute them. they decided not to do that. we could send them to robben island and put them in the south african system so they weren't together. they didn't want to do that because they thought it would be like individual germs and affect the whole system. but by keeping them together on robben island, they loved each other and reinforced...
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but like other early giants at the anc, zulus and mutombos, madiba disciplined his anger and channeled his desire to fight in the organization and platforms and strategies for action. so men and women could stand up for their god-given dignity. moreover, he accepted the consequences of his actions, knowing that standing up to powerful interests and injustice carries a price. i have fought against white domination. i have fought against black domination. i have cherished the ideal of a democratic and free society in which all persons live together in harmony and equal opportunities. it is an ideal which i hope to live for and to achieve, but if need be, it is an ideal for which i am prepared to die. mandela taught us the power of action but he also taught us the power of ideas, the importance of reason and arguments, the need to study not only those who you agree with but also those who you don't agree with. he understood that ideas cannot be contained by prison walls or extinguished by a sniper's bullet. he turned his trial into an indictment of apartheid, because of his eloquence and
but like other early giants at the anc, zulus and mutombos, madiba disciplined his anger and channeled his desire to fight in the organization and platforms and strategies for action. so men and women could stand up for their god-given dignity. moreover, he accepted the consequences of his actions, knowing that standing up to powerful interests and injustice carries a price. i have fought against white domination. i have fought against black domination. i have cherished the ideal of a...
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fidel castro was financially supporting the anc when the u.s. and other world powers were shunning them, some considered them a terrorist group. at some point the u.s. was not on the right side of history when it came to south africa. it is very fitting you have cuba's leader front and center, speen a speaking role there. is it possible there could be recness of cuba's role at that time that could alter perhaps the way the united states sees cuba today? >> i'm not sure i'd go that far, but i do think that any son mandela in his early years depended heavily upon a number of people we found odious in the united states, including moma gadhafi. if he'd been alive today, perhaps he would have spoken, as well. it speaks to the mandela journey that in the beginning he was regarded by the west, i about the united states, by britain, by margaret thatcher as a terrorist. but as we've learned over time, one man's terrorist is another man's freedom fighter. i think he evolved and now we see him as a freedom fighter. just as we saw many people who fought to
fidel castro was financially supporting the anc when the u.s. and other world powers were shunning them, some considered them a terrorist group. at some point the u.s. was not on the right side of history when it came to south africa. it is very fitting you have cuba's leader front and center, speen a speaking role there. is it possible there could be recness of cuba's role at that time that could alter perhaps the way the united states sees cuba today? >> i'm not sure i'd go that far,...
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he started the armed wing of the anc. >> right. started as a fighter. i think it magnifies the importance of the message which is why i wanted you to give us perspective on it, rick, because if you believe he is someone who is just better than we are, you know, he just didn't feel the anger and hostility and bitterness that i would, or you would, then that's one type of person, but when you know he did feel every bit as much, he had that fierceness in him, it's what he did with it, i think it magnifies the message. >> absolutely. one of the things i've written about is this sense of fear. there were so many times we were talking and he would say to me "i was terrified. i was afraid." here is nelson mandela telling me he was afraid, terrified. he once said to me "it would be irrational not to have been terrified." i was on a plane ride with him once, one of the engines went out and i was a little nervous about it, and i looked at him, and he just was reading the newspaper like nothing happened and when we got on the ground about a half an hour later he s
he started the armed wing of the anc. >> right. started as a fighter. i think it magnifies the importance of the message which is why i wanted you to give us perspective on it, rick, because if you believe he is someone who is just better than we are, you know, he just didn't feel the anger and hostility and bitterness that i would, or you would, then that's one type of person, but when you know he did feel every bit as much, he had that fierceness in him, it's what he did with it, i...
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very principled in the fact that if gadhafi, if the libyans or the cubans had given assistance to the anc in times of trouble, he felt loyal. he was very loyal to his friends. he would show the friendship back. what you are going to see is a mismatch of people. hemowho are celebrities, naomi campbell known for her temper and being a hot headed model sitting next to perhaps the head of iran. you know? there's a wonderful image when you can see about tomorrow. i think that is mandela as his p.a. said today, he's bringing people toothing in death as well as he did in life. >> we're looking at pictures of mandela dancing. he was somebody who celebrated life, as well, bringing so many people together. you just can't help but. >> i will and be inspired when you see these images. thank you. appreciate that. the image of bill clinton at robben island, what an amazing treat to see that up close. >> you've got world leaders going there, including he was very critical of george w. bush over the iraq war and bush is heading down there. he was critical of the united states way back in 2003. i think he
very principled in the fact that if gadhafi, if the libyans or the cubans had given assistance to the anc in times of trouble, he felt loyal. he was very loyal to his friends. he would show the friendship back. what you are going to see is a mismatch of people. hemowho are celebrities, naomi campbell known for her temper and being a hot headed model sitting next to perhaps the head of iran. you know? there's a wonderful image when you can see about tomorrow. i think that is mandela as his p.a....
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the anc had been fanned anyway. people like fidel castro in cuba supported mandela. >> when he came out of prison, he spoke very loudly about my friend fidel castro. >> he's been condemned in certain countries for the so-called terrorism. >> here's the video. they embraced. >> mandela then made a plea to clinton in 1996 he said let us lift the sanctions that the u.s. has imposed against cuba. here is what clinton had to say. >> sometimes, he could be very serious and say i just don't understand why you don't lift the embargo. and i said, well, i think we were about to do it before they shot down those planes illegally in the brothers to the rescue tragedy. and then congress removed the right to lift the embargo. and sometimes, had was just joking about it but underneath all of that, there was mandela's fierce loyalty to anybody who had stuck by him personally and by the anc, the african national congress, his party, during his long 27 years in prison. and castro did. and mandela never forgot it. >> a fiercely loyal
the anc had been fanned anyway. people like fidel castro in cuba supported mandela. >> when he came out of prison, he spoke very loudly about my friend fidel castro. >> he's been condemned in certain countries for the so-called terrorism. >> here's the video. they embraced. >> mandela then made a plea to clinton in 1996 he said let us lift the sanctions that the u.s. has imposed against cuba. here is what clinton had to say. >> sometimes, he could be very serious...
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anc theater gearing up to go public. most loyal customers buying shares. members of anc sub rewards program, they offered the same price as bank and wall street zugs institutions according to jerry lopez, so everybody getting in on the action. >> the only thing i care about is what this means for ticket prices. i am saying it is expensive to go to the movies. >> i don't think you will see prices go up. i think they are sharing the love. >> sharing the love, is that what they're doing? >> exactly. thanks, allison. coming up next on "new day," budget de ja vu. four days and counting until congress can get its act together this time around. accidence of u.s. leaders convergeing on south africa, paying tribute to nelson mandela. chris cuomo is there live. he is speaking which someone who knew mandela well. ♪ (train horn) vo: wherever our trains go, the economy comes to life. norfolk southern. one line, infinite possibilities. to help secure retirements and protect financial futures. to help communities recover and rebuild. for companies going from garage to
anc theater gearing up to go public. most loyal customers buying shares. members of anc sub rewards program, they offered the same price as bank and wall street zugs institutions according to jerry lopez, so everybody getting in on the action. >> the only thing i care about is what this means for ticket prices. i am saying it is expensive to go to the movies. >> i don't think you will see prices go up. i think they are sharing the love. >> sharing the love, is that what...
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many people i've spoken to through this week expressing disappointment that the current anc government hasn't done more to bring those people up. but certainly, the predominant feeling this week is one of mourning and of celebration of this great man, nelson mandela, and certainly, people will be looking forward to the next several days of commemoration in pretoria and at his hometown later this week. >> i was expecting that stadium to be packed, jam-packed. i know the weather was bad, it was raining, but there were a lot of empty seats there. was it simply because of the weather? >> reporter: i think it was because of the weather and maybe because people were worried about how difficult it would be to get to that stadium as well. mostly a logistical issue. they also had other viewing places across the country but also it might be that this has been several days in the making. the true emotional moment would have been on friday after the announcement came and also, we must remember that nelson mandela was sick for several months, in fact, bedridden, so south africans in some way were e
many people i've spoken to through this week expressing disappointment that the current anc government hasn't done more to bring those people up. but certainly, the predominant feeling this week is one of mourning and of celebration of this great man, nelson mandela, and certainly, people will be looking forward to the next several days of commemoration in pretoria and at his hometown later this week. >> i was expecting that stadium to be packed, jam-packed. i know the weather was bad, it...
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. >> yes, it was actually the night of the -- when they won, when the anc won, my mom went to a party in south africa, and he pulled her up on the stage, and you can see them dancing. great picture. >> very nice. martin luther king iii, thank you so much. appreciate your reflection. safe journey as you contemplate your journey to say your final good-byes to nelson mandela. >>> we'll talk about the latest job numbers. very encouraging in many circles. good news say some with more people going back to work, but is it the temporary fix, or are we seeing the end of a great recession? i'll ask former labor secretary robert reich. he joins us next in the "newsroom." thanks for giving me your smile. thanks for inspiring me. thanks for showing me my potential. for teaching me not to take life so seriously. thanks for loving me and being my best friend. don't forget to thank those who helped you take charge of your future and got you where you are today. the boss of your life. the chief life officer. ♪ are still high in acidic content. if your enamel is exposed to acid and you brush it away,
. >> yes, it was actually the night of the -- when they won, when the anc won, my mom went to a party in south africa, and he pulled her up on the stage, and you can see them dancing. great picture. >> very nice. martin luther king iii, thank you so much. appreciate your reflection. safe journey as you contemplate your journey to say your final good-byes to nelson mandela. >>> we'll talk about the latest job numbers. very encouraging in many circles. good news say some with...
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it was as the leader of the anc that he took part in those historic negotiations. i say that in particular because the tone of some comments that have been made about him -- not so much here today, but elsewhere, and for the best and most well-meaning of reasons -- is such that it is almost as if he was somehow above politics. of course, he became admired and revered, quite rightly, but he was not above politics; he was practicing politics. he was engaged in politics, and it was through politics that the transformation of south africa was secured. like many here, i had the opportunity to meet nelson mandela on a number of occasions. one i particularly recall in these days was in 1998 when i attended the commemoration of the 50th anniversary of the signing of the general agreement on tariffs and trade. seated in the hall, i heard a tremendous commotion at the rear. the delegate from south africa had arrived, and a kind of wave passed through the hall as delegates from every country in the world rose spontaneously to applaud him. i was both honored and humbled when h
it was as the leader of the anc that he took part in those historic negotiations. i say that in particular because the tone of some comments that have been made about him -- not so much here today, but elsewhere, and for the best and most well-meaning of reasons -- is such that it is almost as if he was somehow above politics. of course, he became admired and revered, quite rightly, but he was not above politics; he was practicing politics. he was engaged in politics, and it was through...
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and it was as the leader of the anc that he took part in those historic negotiations. i say that, mr. speaker, particularly because i think it's important to recognize it when some of the tone of what has been said for all the best and most well meaning of reasons not so much here today, but in comments about him is almost as if he was somehow i above politics. of course, he became admired and revered, quite rightly. but he wasn't above be politics. he was practicing politics. he was engaged in politics. and it was through politics that the transformation of south africa was secured. like many here, i had the opportunity to meet him on a number of occasions, and one i particularly recall in the these days was when in 1998 i attended the commemoration of the 50th anniversary of the signing of the gap. seated in the hall, i heard this tremendous commotion at the rear. the delegates from south africa had arrived, and a kind of wave passed through the hall as delegates from every country in the world rose spontaneously to applaud him. and i was both honored and humbled whe
and it was as the leader of the anc that he took part in those historic negotiations. i say that, mr. speaker, particularly because i think it's important to recognize it when some of the tone of what has been said for all the best and most well meaning of reasons not so much here today, but in comments about him is almost as if he was somehow i above politics. of course, he became admired and revered, quite rightly. but he wasn't above be politics. he was practicing politics. he was engaged in...
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. >> i want to address if you want and keep ance company it issue. the president was speaking for the american people. insurancespeaking for companies. which doesn't make him a liar. you can keep your insurance it.any if you want he wasn't speaking for the insurance company. i would like to address also to guests, what are epublicans doing to help this country? thank you? >> scott wilson, some of how the public perception is on some of the issues of the health care law. the president t if you quently about like your insurance plan, you plan, p your insurance that was a pithy way that people ho try to get their insurance, the vast majority of americans, should not fear the new legislation. it did not turn out to be the case. the fact of the matter is that the legislation was written in a way to weed out insurance that were not meeting minimum standards set out by the law. so the white house knew that that was not going to be the case for every american. they just saw it was going to be a small percentage of americans who were not going to be able to k
. >> i want to address if you want and keep ance company it issue. the president was speaking for the american people. insurancespeaking for companies. which doesn't make him a liar. you can keep your insurance it.any if you want he wasn't speaking for the insurance company. i would like to address also to guests, what are epublicans doing to help this country? thank you? >> scott wilson, some of how the public perception is on some of the issues of the health care law. the...
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he said at an anc youth league conference in 1951, and i quote, "true, the struggle will be a bitter one. leaders will be deported, imprisoned, and even shot. the government will terrorize the people and their leaders in an effort to halt the forward march. ordinary forms of organization will be rendered impossible, but the spirit of the people cannot be crushed ntil full victory is won." this struggle became madiba's life. he was at the forefront of the radical change in the anc in the 1940's, advancing the long walk to freedom. he became a volunteer in chief during the defiance campaign in the early 1950's and became the first commander in chief of the anc's armed wing, umkhonto we sizwe, in the early 1960's. he paid dearly for his beliefs and actions through imprisonment. he stated in 1962, "i was made by the law a criminal, not because of what i had done, but because of what i stood for, because of what i thought, because of my conscience." arrested and sentenced to life imprisonment during the rivonia trial later in 1964, he never lost his fighting spirit. for 27 years, the sout
he said at an anc youth league conference in 1951, and i quote, "true, the struggle will be a bitter one. leaders will be deported, imprisoned, and even shot. the government will terrorize the people and their leaders in an effort to halt the forward march. ordinary forms of organization will be rendered impossible, but the spirit of the people cannot be crushed ntil full victory is won." this struggle became madiba's life. he was at the forefront of the radical change in the anc in...
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the most amazing story he told me was that on the night before they left prison he called all the anc prisoners together, saying, yes, they would be justified in acts of revenge, retaliation and retribution, but that there could never then be a strong, successful multiracial society, and that was his second great achievement -- to achieve change through reconciliation. but there was also a third achievement -- in refusing to rest or relax when he gave up the presidency, he had a third great, historic, far less acknowledged, achievement to his name. he wrote that in the first part of his life he had climbed one great mountain, to end apartheid, but now in his later life he wanted to climb another great mountain -- to rid the world of poverty, and especially the outrage of child poverty. i need speak only of what i saw in the times that i worked with him -- how quietly and without fanfare he went about his work. in 2005 i flew to south africa to meet nelson mandela to persuade him to come to london so that he could then persuade the finance ministers of the need for debt relief to relie
the most amazing story he told me was that on the night before they left prison he called all the anc prisoners together, saying, yes, they would be justified in acts of revenge, retaliation and retribution, but that there could never then be a strong, successful multiracial society, and that was his second great achievement -- to achieve change through reconciliation. but there was also a third achievement -- in refusing to rest or relax when he gave up the presidency, he had a third great,...
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step number two i think there's state and ance for local leaders as well, in terms focus tong the overall problem solving. third, i suspect over a short period of time a large grassroots network of people who are looking for problem solvers in their elected officials, probably a million people in every congressional district in this country is what we want to have in the next several months. i think we're a good part of the way there. so if you think of no labels, i think of problem solving. i want you to think of a group that's also proving the concept. it isn't just catchy phrases and nice sound bites, but we're we're justneedle and getting it going. and i'm excited about where this is leading to, because we have nation.e in this we have no choice. ahead will have to be about problem solving. t will be about getting taxes right, debt right, education right, getting the foundational building blocks of this nation in a place where we can actually get our house in order. that's what it so desperately needed right now. so we're delighted to be here. we thank you for listening here. thank yo
step number two i think there's state and ance for local leaders as well, in terms focus tong the overall problem solving. third, i suspect over a short period of time a large grassroots network of people who are looking for problem solvers in their elected officials, probably a million people in every congressional district in this country is what we want to have in the next several months. i think we're a good part of the way there. so if you think of no labels, i think of problem solving. i...
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is skilled, largest hit by having part of the guerrilla army, the formation, the armed wing of the anc and the chief of intelligence. slate got this succession of people from different parts of the liberation movement taking over who had been out of the country for longer to time, or had been imprisoned for laundries of time. and to a certain extent that shape some of the mistakes that have been made in the last yea years. >> does thabo mbeki talk but what surprised we came back after all those years and except? >> want to thank you quickly learn when you interview people or politicians and political power is nothing ever surprise them. so the main thing that upset him every time i was into being and is, i would ask that question what would surprise you to what was unusual, what jumped out at you? every, i would say that he would lean back, take a look at me with a lizardlike look when you know you have irritated him. and that would come. know, my brother, never surprised. never admit you were surprised. i think the things that surprised thabo mbeki certainly who was the second preside
is skilled, largest hit by having part of the guerrilla army, the formation, the armed wing of the anc and the chief of intelligence. slate got this succession of people from different parts of the liberation movement taking over who had been out of the country for longer to time, or had been imprisoned for laundries of time. and to a certain extent that shape some of the mistakes that have been made in the last yea years. >> does thabo mbeki talk but what surprised we came back after all...
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all i knew the anc was being backed by comb anytime munists learned that south africa was wrong. if you feel really strongly about this man, you can still act, because there's plenty of people around the world who are under the thumb of evil. and there's a lot of celebrities who don't care. there are women still being circumcised in africa. it's a horrible practice. there are gays persecuted in iran. there are christians in islamic countries that are being persecuted. the time is ripe for a lot of new mandelas. >> i like that, greg, that might be my favorite comment you've made so far. >> just a quick thought. and i don't have as much knowledge on nelson mandela as the rest of you. i'll just say, a man would appears to have a lot of passion, a lot of resolve, a lot of principle, not necessarily agree with a lot of the things he stood for, so i'll say rest in peace. i think it's a nice outreach. president and mrs. obama reached out to the bushes, 43, and they will be joining, the bushes will be joining the president on air force one to go to the memorial services next week. intere
all i knew the anc was being backed by comb anytime munists learned that south africa was wrong. if you feel really strongly about this man, you can still act, because there's plenty of people around the world who are under the thumb of evil. and there's a lot of celebrities who don't care. there are women still being circumcised in africa. it's a horrible practice. there are gays persecuted in iran. there are christians in islamic countries that are being persecuted. the time is ripe for a lot...
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in that october, that was the first time the anc was allowed to gather in the legal fashion. it was considered a terrorist group at the time. i remember how the crowd hushed for the first time. they raised their hands in the air and sang the national anthem. it means god bless africa, had been illegal up until that point in october 1989. at that point you knew things were changing rapidly and the clerk had started something he wasn't going to be able to stop. a par tide was ending. nelson man dell laugh was to be released from prison. he was held on robin island five miles off the coast and like alcatraz like many years. he talked where he wrote his long walk to freedom, auto biography. they spent grueling hours in the sun breaking rocks on the island looking in the distance at the mountain in cape town and the beautiful cape town in the distance. mandela became close to his prison guards. i remember when we were down there in 1990 in february that they had to release a picture of what he looked like. it had been illegal for any newspaper to publish a picture of mandela. in f
in that october, that was the first time the anc was allowed to gather in the legal fashion. it was considered a terrorist group at the time. i remember how the crowd hushed for the first time. they raised their hands in the air and sang the national anthem. it means god bless africa, had been illegal up until that point in october 1989. at that point you knew things were changing rapidly and the clerk had started something he wasn't going to be able to stop. a par tide was ending. nelson man...
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27 years and it had been illegal to publish his picture or utter his name to, in fact, to sing the anc national anthem. there were so many changes in that year when i was a young journalist in south africa. >> thanks very much. and again those are the pictures in the lower screen, the people outside nelson mandela's home tonight. the world reacting to the death of nelson mandela. dr. ben carson is here next as our coverage of this breaking news continues. >>> okay, everyone, it's time to ha i >>> the world is remembering nelson mandela. politicians and celebrities taking to facebook and twitter posting their condolences. former president bill clinton tweeting this photo with this caption, i will nevertheless forget my friend. and george w. bush posting, he was one of the great forces for freedom and equality of our time. he bore his burdens with dignity and grace. he will be miss but his contributions will live on forever. >>> and john boehner tweeted. and condoleeza rice posting, throughout history a few special people have been able to transcend differences and change theor the bette
27 years and it had been illegal to publish his picture or utter his name to, in fact, to sing the anc national anthem. there were so many changes in that year when i was a young journalist in south africa. >> thanks very much. and again those are the pictures in the lower screen, the people outside nelson mandela's home tonight. the world reacting to the death of nelson mandela. dr. ben carson is here next as our coverage of this breaking news continues. >>> okay, everyone, it's...
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generally they don't give you insure ance if you don't cut th a check. is this going to encourage enrollment? as ed just talked about, getting people on the website, the bigger problem may be getting them actually covered. mark is with me tonight. with the american enterprise institute and former speechwriter for former president bush. shouldn't the paying part be the easiest, most seamless part of the process, mark? >> you would think the business would want to get your money. but again, we aren't dealing with the private sector, we are dealing with the government. just this weekend, they said, the website is working with, this is a quote, private sector velocity and effectiveness. they actually said that. unless amazon.com works 90% of the time, unless it is under maintenance, doesn't transmit your information where you make a purchase, and have an on-line waiting room where you can park until there is capacity for you to shop. and look at the 90% staker. they said it works 90% of the time when it is not under maintenance. what does that mean? they don
generally they don't give you insure ance if you don't cut th a check. is this going to encourage enrollment? as ed just talked about, getting people on the website, the bigger problem may be getting them actually covered. mark is with me tonight. with the american enterprise institute and former speechwriter for former president bush. shouldn't the paying part be the easiest, most seamless part of the process, mark? >> you would think the business would want to get your money. but again,...
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whites who wanted to kill him, but moderate whites who wanted to negotiate with him and then on the anc side there were extreme blacks who wanted can carry on the armed struggle and moderate blacks. his party was driven with factions as well and it was only his own, what i think was the difference between the way south africa went and the way other countries went was his own personal leadership skills. jon: yeah and amazing that he developed those skills in the way he did because most politicians kind of learn a little bit at time on the job, you know, from dinners to elections to higher and higher offices. he spent much of his adult life in prison and yet when emerged from prison he was not a bitter, vengeful man. what can you tell us about his thoughts on that? >> right. he spent years, 23 hours out of 24, staring at a blank wall. what kind of training does that give you? he was 71 when he came out of prison. most people, that, spending that long in prison would probably want to go and retire. so, and i think, perhaps one of the things that he learned at that time when he had all thos
whites who wanted to kill him, but moderate whites who wanted to negotiate with him and then on the anc side there were extreme blacks who wanted can carry on the armed struggle and moderate blacks. his party was driven with factions as well and it was only his own, what i think was the difference between the way south africa went and the way other countries went was his own personal leadership skills. jon: yeah and amazing that he developed those skills in the way he did because most...
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that's true in the anc of many leader. they made a sacrifice for the cause, and it took an economic toll on their families. >> we're seeing the outpouring in these days since mandela's death, but how distant a figure had he become in the country? >> not distant at all. i think nelson mandela was still the moral center. and many with their disappointment about the leadership of the anc and its more material orientation would refer back to nelson mandela. 2005, 2007, 2011, his presence was still important within the anc. you'll recall in 2013 the anc leadership took pictures with him to try to shore up their own presence. his activism in the party diminished even just over two years or so. >> we're going to be hearing from president obama later this morning. we'll also hear from several members of the mandela family. that is andrew melengheni, a president with nelson mandela in robben island. appears to be wrapping up again. >> thank you very much. >> thank you very much. we're here to mourn him in dignity. right now we woul
that's true in the anc of many leader. they made a sacrifice for the cause, and it took an economic toll on their families. >> we're seeing the outpouring in these days since mandela's death, but how distant a figure had he become in the country? >> not distant at all. i think nelson mandela was still the moral center. and many with their disappointment about the leadership of the anc and its more material orientation would refer back to nelson mandela. 2005, 2007, 2011, his...
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the anc was a terrorist organization at one point. he has since said great things about nelson mandela. i like that what's been said about nelson mandela is said in the same way the pope said what he did. forgiveness and redemption. the pope's widely misinterpreted. and mischaracterized statements. it's active engagement. taking care of each other with solidarity and subsidiary. >> when you say about accusing darth vader, so to speak. this is not just about rhetoric. this is the policy that prevented the anc -- when they had the feet on the neck of nelson mandela -- >> he said, let's forgive. let's forgive dick cheney. let's forgive these people. i think one of the fascinating things about nelson mandela, he wasn't a saint. he made a lot of mistakes. he readily admitted it. he said, i'm not a saint unless you think a saint is a sinner who gets up and tries again every time. he changed an entire country and a world in what he said. done through acts of humility. like the pope has done. authentic acts of humility. >> i think -- one of t
the anc was a terrorist organization at one point. he has since said great things about nelson mandela. i like that what's been said about nelson mandela is said in the same way the pope said what he did. forgiveness and redemption. the pope's widely misinterpreted. and mischaracterized statements. it's active engagement. taking care of each other with solidarity and subsidiary. >> when you say about accusing darth vader, so to speak. this is not just about rhetoric. this is the policy...
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the anc at a point where they formed in 1961 decided to respond back violently. moreover, there was not just violence between the white regime and sort of the black movement, but also between different ethnic groups. there was the zulu that was also quite violent toward the group from nelson mandela's ethnic group. it was tension across society. >> even within mandela's own family. his former wife winnie mandela, often was called for supporting violence and mandela often expressed displeasure with that. >> he did. in a remarkable interview, however, he said, look, people are free to choose their routes, their particular methods of response. he made clear that the oppressor will determine how the oppressor responds. when asked about his affiliations or his affiliations with people that took up violence or armed struggle. he said, look that depends upon the method of response. the method of response depends on what the oppressor does. at the same time he was critical of the necklaces, of the violence opposed. he said this replicates the violence done to us in the n
the anc at a point where they formed in 1961 decided to respond back violently. moreover, there was not just violence between the white regime and sort of the black movement, but also between different ethnic groups. there was the zulu that was also quite violent toward the group from nelson mandela's ethnic group. it was tension across society. >> even within mandela's own family. his former wife winnie mandela, often was called for supporting violence and mandela often expressed...
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becoming a leading voice in the african national congress, the anc. but in 1960, after police shot and killed 69 protesters, the anc, which had always been nonviolent, created a military wing, under mandela's command. >> there are many people who feel that it is useless and futile for us to continue talking peace and nonviolence against a government whose reply is only savage attacks. >> reporter: undaunted by the brutality and inequality that was apartheid rule, mandela remained determined to end the government's forced racial segregation. >> our struggle is a truly national one. it is a struggle for the right to live. >> reporter: a struggle that led to mandela's imprisonment in 1962. and two years later, a life sentence for working to overthrow the government. >> i have cherished the ideal of a democratic and free society. it is an ideal for which i hope to live for and to see realized. but my lords, if it needs be, it is an idea for which i am prepared to die. >> reporter: four miles off the coast of capetown, south africa, on robben island, mande
becoming a leading voice in the african national congress, the anc. but in 1960, after police shot and killed 69 protesters, the anc, which had always been nonviolent, created a military wing, under mandela's command. >> there are many people who feel that it is useless and futile for us to continue talking peace and nonviolence against a government whose reply is only savage attacks. >> reporter: undaunted by the brutality and inequality that was apartheid rule, mandela remained...
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. >> the anc was out lawed and in 1964, mandela was sentenced to life in prison, attempting to over throw the government. imprisoned on robbins island, he became a powerful symbol of resistance. he was released from prison in 1990 and emerged as the face of the antiapart i'd movement. he appeared before a standing room crowd at the oakland colosseum. >> it is you, the people of oakland, the people of the bay area, who have given me and my delegation strength and hope to grow. >> mandela stepped into negotiations with fk declerk to bring multieration-ratial democracy. he was the first black president. >> so help me god. never, and never again, shall it be that this beautiful land will again experience the oppression of one or another. >>> thousands of people have responded on our facebook page on the passing of mandela. you can join a conversation by going to ktvu chan 2 on facebook. >>> bart apologized for yesterday's emergency that stranded 700 people in a smokey disabled train. the train came to a stop? the berkeley tunnel after a short circuit caused the brakes to engage. the train ope
. >> the anc was out lawed and in 1964, mandela was sentenced to life in prison, attempting to over throw the government. imprisoned on robbins island, he became a powerful symbol of resistance. he was released from prison in 1990 and emerged as the face of the antiapart i'd movement. he appeared before a standing room crowd at the oakland colosseum. >> it is you, the people of oakland, the people of the bay area, who have given me and my delegation strength and hope to grow....
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let's remember, the anc that he refers to, they were pursuing freedom. many of the communist nations embraced them, this country did not. it was not like they were born marxist, they were born people seeking to be free. some of the marxist nation either genuinely or in a self-interest way tried to embrace that. this country did not and fought that and denounced them and denigrated them. and i think for us now to sugarcoat that is a betrayal of history. we chose sides. we chose the wrong side. people in this country turned us around toward the right side. that set the stage for mandela to evolve. but if you're drowning and someone throws you your raft to get out, you don't call them a rafter, you call yourself the one that's trying to stop from drowning. those are the ones that threw the raft in south africa for freedom fighters. >> i think you have to put the african national liberation movements in the global context of the struggle against communism. as the reverend said, they were supported by the soviet union, they were funded by the soviet union, th
let's remember, the anc that he refers to, they were pursuing freedom. many of the communist nations embraced them, this country did not. it was not like they were born marxist, they were born people seeking to be free. some of the marxist nation either genuinely or in a self-interest way tried to embrace that. this country did not and fought that and denounced them and denigrated them. and i think for us now to sugarcoat that is a betrayal of history. we chose sides. we chose the wrong side....